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Pic Disk Question
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Eren_Steyr_Aug



Joined: 30 Aug 2014
Posts: 54
Location: Kadiköy

PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:35 am    Post subject: Pic Disk Question Reply with quote

Why quality of picture disks' sound is weaker than Black ones?
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anthares



Joined: 05 Oct 2008
Posts: 411

PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So much shit on the surface? I dont know.
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Tireheb



Joined: 18 Aug 2007
Posts: 8227
Location: Finland

PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hKgYLxZANU

That's how they make picture discs. The grooves are not pressed into actual vinyl at all but into some thin foil. It's quaranteened to sound shit.
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Haunt In The Dark



Joined: 24 Oct 2009
Posts: 923
Location: Trve De Baal

PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 5:10 am    Post subject: Re: Pic Disk Question Reply with quote

Eren_Steyr_Aug wrote:
Why quality of picture disks' sound is weaker than Black ones?


Because they're ugly as hell and are for collector posers.

More seriously, I think it's just the way they're made, with the labels being covered by some crappy plastic sheet instead of having the grooves properly pressed in the record? The picture-disc's design (grooves over the labels) creates some extra noise that you wouldn't find in a record that's properly pressed. Basically, the picture-disc gimmick should die.
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NWN PROD



Joined: 10 May 2006
Posts: 19721
Location: SF Bay Area

PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 6:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pic LPs are pressed into a different type of plastic that's harder than vinyl.

I thought the recent Beherit pic LP sounded excellent.
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rauta



Joined: 23 Apr 2008
Posts: 1931
Location: Finlandia

PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:56 am    Post subject: Re: Pic Disk Question Reply with quote

Haunt In The Dark wrote:
Basically, the picture-disc gimmick should die.

It's just a matter of using a product for what it was designed for, i.e. decoration. They also make clocks out of records, you know Wink Wouldn't want to play one of those either...
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Haunt In The Dark



Joined: 24 Oct 2009
Posts: 923
Location: Trve De Baal

PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2014 9:18 am    Post subject: Re: Pic Disk Question Reply with quote

rauta wrote:
Haunt In The Dark wrote:
Basically, the picture-disc gimmick should die.

It's just a matter of using a product for what it was designed for, i.e. decoration. They also make clocks out of records, you know Wink Wouldn't want to play one of those either...


At least clocks are useful. Picture-discs are just a waste of ressources.
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Orpheus



Joined: 28 Dec 2011
Posts: 743
Location: Toronto

PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2014 2:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Pic Disk Question Reply with quote

Haunt In The Dark wrote:
rauta wrote:
Haunt In The Dark wrote:
Basically, the picture-disc gimmick should die.

It's just a matter of using a product for what it was designed for, i.e. decoration. They also make clocks out of records, you know Wink Wouldn't want to play one of those either...


At least clocks are useful. Picture-discs are just a waste of ressources.

So are posters. Rolling Eyes
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Asgard



Joined: 09 Aug 2011
Posts: 319
Location: Europa

PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not going to argue with you guys that a lot of picture discs (especially pressed from the early 90s to mid 2000s sound shitty.
I only have few picture discs in my collection anyways, all of them pressed quite recently and I can't say that they are sounding significantly worse.
Denovali for instance has put out Celeste's Nihiliste(s) on picture disc and it sounds as good as any other vinyl.
I think they tend to be gimmicky as well, but the production methods seem to have become a little better.
I'd be interested in how many of people hating pictures discs as such would actually be able to distinguish a recently pressed picture disc from regular vinyl when doing a blind test.
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Wolfram



Joined: 17 Jun 2007
Posts: 3795

PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Agreed with Asgard here..

A few decades ago there was a HUGE picture-LP trend: everything was pressed on picture LP's. Some of you might remember Costa's rant in an old issue of Iron Pegasus.
Now it's a trend to hate picture discs.

We're talking about Black- and Death Metal here; not classical music or something.
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rauta



Joined: 23 Apr 2008
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Location: Finlandia

PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I for sure wouldn't be able to tell the difference every time but when there's a choice between inferior quality decorative object and a decent quality product made of proper material it's not really a choice at all, no matter how small the audial differences might be. Plus there's the issue of durability; I'm going out on a limb assuming that vinyl will maintain its grooves in good condition longer than whatever it is they press those pic discs on.
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Werewolf



Joined: 10 Jan 2008
Posts: 3563
Location: IsraHell

PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I read somewhere that a well preserved vinyl record's estimated durability should be around 300 years. If a picture disc's durability is even only 20% as much, that's not really bad at all Very Happy
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iron tyrant



Joined: 17 Jul 2007
Posts: 2677
Location: ITALIA

PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I absolutely love picture discs and wish there were more of them.
If I can choose between a black vinyl and a pic disc, no doubt I'd go with the pic disc. And probably get the black vinyl as well since I'm such a turd.
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inquisidor



Joined: 13 Jan 2011
Posts: 175
Location: Detroit

PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 4:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When I play picture discs, as soon as the needle hits the groove I can hear a background noise that I don't hear on black vinyl. It happens even on my Sarcofago INRI picture disc that NWN released some time ago. Maybe my needle is very sensitive, I don't know.

I think the worst sounding picture disc I have is the Genocidio S/T.
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ChemicalWarfare



Joined: 02 Sep 2014
Posts: 129
Location: United States of Socialist 'meRica (USSR)

PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I recently bought a 2LP reissue of Live After Death, and it was not advertised as picture disc. I should have done a little more research on Discogs, but needless to say I was disappointed and haven't played it. On the rear of the album there is a written disclaimer in small print that due to being picture disc, the sound will be affected. Mad

I'm not sure if this is real or just a perception on my part, but I feel picture discs wear out needles faster. I shelved the Iron Maiden records immediately, because I won't play them on my new turntable.

I do keep an old cheap RCA table around just for playing suspect records, but I am currently awaiting on some new needles to arrive. Maybe I'll spin the Maiden records on it and see if these newer picture discs do sound better, than old ones I have from the early 90's.

One thing I have noticed though is that as the picture vinyl warms up, the sound improves. 3-4 spins and it does get better, the crackling and thin sound go away. Again could just be perception.
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