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Lets talk turntables.
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drinks



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 786

PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jameswolfe wrote:
drinks will be dissapointed but I just got this

It's only really the Debut I have issues with, or at least the decks with the shorter tonearms. Their "real" arms (9cc and up) look the business.

Uh... What is it? Never seen this one before. The plinth looks like a 2Xperience Classic, but the arm from the Xpression III? That platter actually looks... classy, unlike many Pro-Ject offerings. Milled aluminum? Is it solid?
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jameswolfe



Joined: 28 Nov 2010
Posts: 1856

PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes solid aluminum. Tone arm is 8.6c. The table is exression classic. Comes with a better platter and cart than expression III.

I actually went with this instead of debut from your advice. This has VTA.
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drinks



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 786

PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looked it up, surprised they can include such a platter at the price point. Though I'm a bit confused, since it's a new table why have they kept the old tonearm rather than using a one piece carbon wand like the new (much cheaper) Debut? Oh well, despite that oversight it does look pretty nice, hope you enjoy it!
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jameswolfe



Joined: 28 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Perhaps I am wrong, but I think both tables use the same tonearm.
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the_flesh



Joined: 14 Nov 2007
Posts: 578
Location: Canada

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that classic table use different tonearm than debut, carbon tonearm but the headshell, only bigger model are 100% carbon. i use to have one and that table is very strong, better than rega p3 (anyway how a table could be great with a glass plate?). that classic is precision, use it with at 440 mla.
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lordoftherim



Joined: 13 Jul 2010
Posts: 2764

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@jameswolfe... how much did the new table set you back?
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astralvesl



Joined: 13 Oct 2010
Posts: 886

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking to upgrade my Ortofon 2m Red (really not a fan), any suggestions in the $100-300 range?
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LazerBeast



Joined: 06 Apr 2011
Posts: 249
Location: Wisconsin

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I recently picked up a Debut III and really like it. $300 was not a bad price to pay for it at all.
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jameswolfe



Joined: 28 Nov 2010
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

lordoftherim wrote:
@jameswolfe... how much did the new table set you back?



699 USD......Needledoctor.com
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drinks



Joined: 15 May 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jameswolfe wrote:
Perhaps I am wrong, but I think both tables use the same tonearm.

This shares the same arm with the previous Xpression. The new Debut has a better wand (but worse bearings and completely plastic base). A definite improvement over the previous Xpression I just wonder why they didn't update the arm since they obviously now have the tooling for efficient mass production of these full carbon fiber wands. Seems bonding a metal shell to a carbon tube might actually be more expensive in terms of labor.

the_flesh wrote:
(anyway how a table could be great with a glass plate?)

Nothing particularly wrong with a glass platter. It's reasonably dense and keeps its shape well in the long term (unlike acrylic or some composites which can more easily warp). The problem is, it rings. So does metal. The key is making sure the platter is appropriately damped, a thin piece of felt doesn't cut it. Throw a heavy rubber mat on a Rega or Systemdek with a glass platter and the sound changes significantly, it's not subtle. But it's all a matter of taste, Rega's sales numbers prove that a lot of people like the ring Wink
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doomedplanet



Joined: 03 Nov 2006
Posts: 446
Location: Oregon

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jameswolfe, how do you change from 33 to 45 on this deck? If you have to remove the platter to do it, for me that is a no-sale 100% of the time.
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drinks



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 786

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

blodhemn9 wrote:
Less moving parts/less interference/less shit to break.

That's just marketing speak for "less costly to produce". A single speed motor is cheaper than a variable speed, there's really no difference in number of "moving parts" or any difference in failure rate. It's cost cutting, plain and simple. And how else could they convince you to pay extra for the outboard speed controllers they sell?

edit:

Not to say the speed controllers aren't worthwhile, they certainly are (and some of Pro-Ject's are actually reasonably priced).
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blodhemn9



Joined: 12 Aug 2009
Posts: 4739
Location: Chicago

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

drinks wrote:
blodhemn9 wrote:
Less moving parts/less interference/less shit to break.

That's just marketing speak for "less costly to produce". A single speed motor is cheaper than a variable speed, there's really no difference in number of "moving parts" or any difference in failure rate. It's cost cutting, plain and simple. And how else could they convince you to pay extra for the outboard speed controllers they sell?


True, that's a good point.

Still, I hardly think spending 6 seconds to lift the platter and put the belt on the other pulley should be a deal breaker if you're happy with the other specs of the TT.
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drinks



Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 786

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought so too until I came across a record that was 33 on one side and 45 on the other Laughing

It's just an unnecessary pain in the ass, plus it's not good for the bearing to constantly have to remove and re-seat the platter. It's a deal breaker for me as well, but as stated the speed boxes do make this a non-issue.

Doomed I forgot what you were looking to spend, but the Pro-Ject Xperience Classic are now on sale for $200 off and are very nice turntables. You have to change the belt, but it's not under the platter so it's just a flick of the finger. Excellent 9cc tonearm included.
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jameswolfe



Joined: 28 Nov 2010
Posts: 1856

PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

doomedplanet wrote:
jameswolfe, how do you change from 33 to 45 on this deck? If you have to remove the platter to do it, for me that is a no-sale 100% of the time.



Yes you do. It really only takes a few seconds so its not much bother for me. And as drinks said you can get a speedbox to do it with the flick of a switch.
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